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6.5L won't even hit on ether

22K views 28 replies 16 participants last post by  oldblacksmoker 
#1 ·
Just bought a parts truck that is claimed to have 8,000 miles on a brand new GM 6.5L crate motor. Motor looks as if it is brand new, with the 6.5L Goodwrench sticker on the valve cover. It is a 93, has the manual pump, but I am not getting and fuel to the filter. I tried putting another lift pump on it to see if the motor would run, but stlll getting no fuel directly from the pump. The thing that concerns me the most is that the truck won't even act like it will fire on ether. Anything that will possibly run will hit off ether, but it has no effect on this engine. What's the reasoning for this? And please no comments on how using ether on a diesel is bad bc that's just bs.
 
#3 · (Edited)
And please no comments on how using ether on a diesel is bad bc that's just bs.
No it's not BS at all especially on a diesel with glow plugs. Read the label on the can. Read the sticker on the air filter housing. I'm sure your much smarter than the GM engineers that created that sticker though. :rolleyes:
 
#4 ·
Your LP is bad and may be the OPS is bad also.

That is a 93, so no PMD so LP and OPS are very important.

No need for Ether.
 
#5 · (Edited)
For testing, direct wire your lift pump to manually engage it. Make sure it has power to it. Open the petcock on the fuel line in your engine bay and start up the lift pump. Check to see if you have fuel coming out. Change out your fuel filter too. If it has been sitting, that think might be gunked. That should at least put fuel to your injection pump.

After that, its time to check air intake making sure it is clear. You'd be surprised what critters climb up into. You might want to pull the boot off your air can to the turbo just to check it clear.

Then, its on to the glow plug relay and plugs.

Might be more to it than that. But that is where i would start. IMO.

Just a question: Is the motor still in the donor vehicle? Or did you already switch it out? If its still in the donor, could be bad fuel as well. Just a thought.
 
#6 ·
If Ether on a 6.5 diesel is bull ****, you do not deserve a responce!
 
#7 ·
scooter, try using WD40 instead of ether, it is easier to start than diesel but wont possibly blow up on your glow plugs or explode in your cylinders. If you have access or extra funds, I think advance auto sells a electric universal diesel pump you can drop in a bucket of fuel and hook strait to your IP. With fuel strait to your pump you can bypass anything that might not be right with the truck. My 6.2 has a solenoid on the top of the pump that controls the fuel, whatever does that in your 6.5 hook 12 volts to, that way you have eliminated the truck all together. Plug her in all night to help ease starting and use WD40 ( or ether if your brave) and try to make her fire. I have never worked on a 6.5L so I hope this helps. Whenever we get in a car that wont do as it should thats what we do with the fuel and power, its quicker than chasing fuel and electrical problems in a vehicle. Please be careful with the ether if thats what you use as a starting aid, I have seen engines and trucks destroyed and people hurt, I have also used it in my diesel before when she refused to start under her own power.
 
#8 ·
Either is not good for any diesel let alone an indirect injection diesel with glow plugs or a heated air intake.Unless blowing out the precombustion chambers is your goal.
In cold weather a block heater and properly working glow plugs is all the 6.5 needs.
It has to be real cold for an extended period to even need the block heater but it sure helps to use it for a couple of hours anytime the temp is below freezing.
Even with direct injection diesels either is a poor substitute for a properly working engine to get it started.
Maintain the compression,injectors and the cranking speed (optional block heater)and you should get them started as well without either.
 
#9 ·
If all your factory starting aids fail in a direct inject diesel, ether will not hurt it. Cummins had a factory ether inject in their early models to aid in starting. I have seen real detroits that needed ether to fire off in very cold weather, they dont have glow plugs at all.
 
#10 ·
If all your factory starting aids fail in a direct inject diesel, ether will not hurt it. Cummins had a factory ether inject in their early models to aid in starting. I have seen real detroits that needed ether to fire off in very cold weather, they dont have glow plugs at all.
OK friend,i 'll give you the rundown on ether in these 6.5 diesels.First off, you cannot compare a 2 stroke detroit diesel with a indirect 6.5 ,2 strokes are tottaly diff engines.

OK,jump on me folks

Second, you can use a SLIGHT wiff of ether only if you DISABLE the glow circuit,not doing so can and will blow your engine.To much ether will stop the engine dead in its tracks and can bend con rods,stretch head bolts or break the starter from it moorings.

I use ether to start a 6.2 i have in a wheelloader allready for ten yrs with no ill effect. No operating glow circuit.But COMMON sense applies.

But as been said,in a healty engine it is not needed or wise to use ether.Look for the problem instead.
No fuel to injectors(fix fuel supply)
Fuel to injectors.(check glow circuit)
Do compression test,
look for out of time,( sheared key)
 
#11 ·
I agree, common sense applies. Had a 6.9 in a Ford we cranked everyday for 7+ years every morning with ether. That truck killed a glow plug controller every month and no living
soul could figure out why, wiring man, diesel man, dealership or otherwise. We ran that one until it wore out the camshaft, no telling how many miles. If they were always healthy or didnt cost an arm and a leg to keep healthy there would be no ether on the market. I have seen what ether in the hands of an idiot can do. Saw it blow the intake off a gas burner, blow a cylinder head off a duramax, blow up a potato gun too. All I was saying is ether will make one run if all else fails. I cant speak for everyone, but I would give it a short wiff to make it run before I would spring for a $500 tow bill, or 6-800 worth of glow plugs, controllers and electronics that fry every year. But thats just me. If its all doing what its supposed to you dont even raise the hood, hit the switch and go. If it wont do its thing......well I keep a can behind the seat of mine....just in case.
 
#13 ·
I agree, common sense applies. Had a 6.9 in a Ford we cranked everyday for 7+ years every morning with ether. That truck killed a glow plug controller every month and no living
soul could figure out why, wiring man, diesel man, dealership or otherwise. We ran that one until it wore out the camshaft, no telling how many miles. If they were always healthy or didnt cost an arm and a leg to keep healthy there would be no ether on the market. I have seen what ether in the hands of an idiot can do. Saw it blow the intake off a gas burner, blow a cylinder head off a duramax, blow up a potato gun too. All I was saying is ether will make one run if all else fails. I cant speak for everyone, but I would give it a short wiff to make it run before I would spring for a $500 tow bill, or 6-800 worth of glow plugs, controllers and electronics that fry every year. But thats just me. If its all doing what its supposed to you dont even raise the hood, hit the switch and go. If it wont do its thing......well I keep a can behind the seat of mine....just in case.
Very well said, I keep a can behind my seat also for that unplanned emergency...
 
#14 ·
Most of your are missing the point!!! I really don't care for anyone's opinion if either is good or bad. This is the simple fact that I would like an answer to. Should the truck hit on either? The truck has a manual pump. No fuel to it. Regardless of all that, when either is sprayed into the engine, shouldn't it hit???? If not, I'm guessing there's motor problems? I also removed the air filter (no blockage), and removed the top hat. I poured a little diesel fuel down the intake. Batteries were dead, so we pulled it around and popped the clutch (with the fuel down the intake). However I couldn't tell if it hit or not b/c the tractor we were pulling with was too loud. But I don't believe it hit. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks.
 
#23 · (Edited)
Most of your are missing the point!!! I really don't care for anyone's opinion if either is good or bad. This is the simple fact that I would like an answer to. Should the truck hit on either? The truck has a manual pump. No fuel to it. Regardless of all that, when either is sprayed into the engine, shouldn't it hit???? If not, I'm guessing there's motor problems? I also removed the air filter (no blockage), and removed the top hat. I poured a little diesel fuel down the intake. Batteries were dead, so we pulled it around and popped the clutch (with the fuel down the intake). However I couldn't tell if it hit or not b/c the tractor we were pulling with was too loud. But I don't believe it hit. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks.
yes it should hit on ether even with a dead IP and run with the right amount added continiously.

you either have very low compression or the thing is badly out of time(sheared crank or cam shaft key)
 
#15 · (Edited)
There's your problem.

no fuel to the pump means it'll never run.

To answer your question yes it'll hit on ether.

Any idea what ether was originally used for? It was used in hospitals to "put you out" for surgery, but when they found out how flammable it was it was done away with. Too much ether and you'd sleep forever, much like your engine will sleep forever if you keep it up because i know your not being smart about it. Your annoyed the engine won't start, so you'll spray ether in it, and it still refuses to start. so you spray more, still won't start, spray more. See where it's going? You'll kill it, if you already haven't. Not my engine but you'd better believe you'd never sit in anything i own.

We've told you the most common no start issues already. It's up to you if you want to follow them or not.

Replace the damn glowplugs, ditch the Ether. Fix your LP or OPS, or do the universal pump into a bucket of fuel directly to the IP for diagnostic procedures to see if the LP and OPS are at fault. Odds are they are, or are at least adding to the issue your having. The DB2 needs power at the 12/10 gauge pink wire for the pump to "turn on". no power = no go.
 
#16 ·
Better pull the glow plugs and do a compression test before you tackle the other problems.
Getting it to hit on either is of no value since you don't have any fuel to keep it running if it does hit,and it could fire too early and try to turn the engine backwards or lock it up until the either dissapates.
If you have timing chain problems nothing will make it fire if the valves are open on the compression stroke.
 
#17 ·
I'm not gonna get into the ether discussion, your engine, your money.
Ether SHOULD get a reaction from the engine. So should pouring a small amount of diesel directly into intake.
Checking compression would possibly save you a lot of time.
 
#18 · (Edited)
I am sorry scooter seemed to get side tracked on the do's and dont's of ether. Dave and Racer are dead on the money. If its capable of running under its own power it will hit on ether. May not run but will bump and smoke for sure. If she wont its down to timing. Compression check will tell you if its all working together like its supposed to be. If it was running when it quit, I would think timing chain. If you turned it off then it quit, thats not a something timing does. I have never heard of one getting out of time not running. Good Luck sir.

You might press the previous owner for more info, if you can get a hold to them. Any little info might shorten your quest to get this thing running.
 
#20 ·
I poured a little diesel fuel down the intake. Batteries were dead, so we pulled it around and popped the clutch (with the fuel down the intake). However I couldn't tell if it hit or not b/c the tractor we were pulling with was too loud. But I don't believe it hit. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks.
Yikes!:eek: Pouring fuel down the intake and trying to start it. Is about the best way I know to hydrolock a diesel engine and break things.
 
#21 · (Edited)
ok guys, this isn't really a thread of the do's and don'ts of ether. he's aware, its a parts motor. his question is should it try to fire. pouring diesel down the intake may make it smoke, but it won't help it fire much as its not atomized and can hydrolic the cylinders, causing more damage than the ether can. it should give you a bit of a stutter on ether, usually right after its done trying to be locked up on ether
 
#22 ·
DO NOT USE EITHER

That being said... I've been to lazy to change out the glow plug controller in my 6.2, so I've used STARTER FLUID (its about 1/4 strength of REAL either) on occasion... A very small amount is all it takes. If it starts and the RPM's shoot up, you've used to much. It should start like normal.

Now the question, "Should it hit on either?" In my experience... maybe... My 6.2 w/DB2 does, but my 6.5's with DS pumps don't. I can't explain it, but I've used either on 4 differnt 6.5's and it has had no effect for me. Almost like it combusts to soon, hurts more than it helps... I won't use either in a 6.5 ever again...

Only way to get them to fire is to have the glow plugs working and fuel to the injectors... anything else is just a waste of time
 
#24 ·
I,d charge the batteries up ,& make sure you have lots & lots of cranking speed . That would at least take slow cranking out of the equation.
 
#25 ·
Wanted to follow back up. We finally got the engine running. We had to bypass the fuel tank because the line had a leak in it. TOO MUCH AIR! So from behind the LP we ran a rubber hose into a gas can, and strapped it to the side of the bed. We then pull started it and finally got the engine to hit and run. It still baffles me though, on why it wouldnt hit on ether originally. I think I've narrowed it down to two things that others have posted. 1: slow cranking speed originally, or 2: perhaps some 6.5L's won't hit on starting fluid?
 
#27 ·
Air in fuel will cause fuel not too flow. This particular diesel truck does not like air at all.
 
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