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Old 05-13-2009, 08:00 PM   #1 (permalink)
4320Diesel
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6.2 timing stuff

my 6.2 is gettin hard to start so i was planning on checking the timing what mkae do i line up on the engine damper? i know the one in the ip and do i hafta take the intake off to get at the cover? while i have the cover off im gonna turn up the fuel 1/16th of a turn and stuff if my timing is off i might change out the timing chain how hard is this to do and what all is involved? is there gears that drive the camshaft and then a chain up to the ip or is it one long chain thanks!!
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1985 GMC (The Brown Streak) Sierra Classic 1500 4WD With 6.2L V8 Diesel and 4speed NP833 trans with hurst shifter! , 4911 6.5 ip with 6.5 shortie injectors GM-3 turbo. Single plane J code intake from Turbonator (thanks guys!). 3" exhaust and 3" BBQ black stacks! Isspro Pyrometer, Trisco Boost and Engine Oil Temp Gauges.
1995 Dodge 2500 Cummins 12 valve NV4500 4x4 LB club cab autometer boost and pyro BrentBilt fuel plate full forward silencer ring MIA straight pipe AFC totally maxed out
1977 GMC high sierra 6500 2WD with 366V8 and 5+2 speed trans
1968 Mercury (The Tank) M-100 2WD with 300 I-6 and 3 on the tree trans
1971 John Deere 4320 with a 404CID With A Factory Shwitzer 3LD turbocharger Crankin 116 horsepower with over 9700 origininal hours on the engine never rebuilt!
1978 John Deere 8630 with a reman 619 CID Diesel out of a 8650 With A Factory Aireasearch TV-6102 turbocharger Crankin 320 Horsepower and 1700 torque
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your wrong brent, i'll think of a reason later

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brent can't do that, it would look factory, lol

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Brent is right.
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Old 05-13-2009, 09:40 PM   #2 (permalink)
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i think the crank to cam is a chain and then gear drove to the ip.
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Old 05-13-2009, 10:02 PM   #3 (permalink)
4320Diesel
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thanks how much might a chain be? i head it was $100 bucks and not too hard to change
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1985 GMC (The Brown Streak) Sierra Classic 1500 4WD With 6.2L V8 Diesel and 4speed NP833 trans with hurst shifter! , 4911 6.5 ip with 6.5 shortie injectors GM-3 turbo. Single plane J code intake from Turbonator (thanks guys!). 3" exhaust and 3" BBQ black stacks! Isspro Pyrometer, Trisco Boost and Engine Oil Temp Gauges.
1995 Dodge 2500 Cummins 12 valve NV4500 4x4 LB club cab autometer boost and pyro BrentBilt fuel plate full forward silencer ring MIA straight pipe AFC totally maxed out
1977 GMC high sierra 6500 2WD with 366V8 and 5+2 speed trans
1968 Mercury (The Tank) M-100 2WD with 300 I-6 and 3 on the tree trans
1971 John Deere 4320 with a 404CID With A Factory Shwitzer 3LD turbocharger Crankin 116 horsepower with over 9700 origininal hours on the engine never rebuilt!
1978 John Deere 8630 with a reman 619 CID Diesel out of a 8650 With A Factory Aireasearch TV-6102 turbocharger Crankin 320 Horsepower and 1700 torque
Quote:
Originally Posted by diaric View Post
your wrong brent, i'll think of a reason later

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Originally Posted by diaric View Post
brent can't do that, it would look factory, lol

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Originally Posted by Trios View Post
Brent is right.
Was there any ever doubt?
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Old 05-14-2009, 12:08 AM   #4 (permalink)
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your gonna have to shop around local for a price, canadian is gonna be way more than what most these guys pay. if you do the chain, then change your water pump at the same time,its already off and you'll be pissed off if you have to rip it all apart later to do it. pay attention to condition of rubber on harmonic balancer and replace if it looks bad. princess auto has a balancer removal/install kit that has the thread adapter for a 6.2 to put it back on
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well to make your pump retarded, you could let it hang out with me for a day
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Diaric wins thread derailment......
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Yeah Diaric, I gotta say, I'm afraid I'm going to have to give you an official warning on that.
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Old 05-14-2009, 01:49 AM   #5 (permalink)
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I was able to purchase a timing kit from Napa for approx $140 cnd locally using a preferred customer account. Without any discount, I believe it costs approx $200.

The install isn't half bad, but can be a bit time consuming. Make sure you stuff a rag into the oil pan opening to catch those pesky woodruff keys when (not if) they drop out of the crank or camshaft and any dirt / dust you produce when you clean up the gasket mating surfaces.

You will need gaskets that run from the engine to the timing cover, and from the timing cover to the water pump plate. If you replace the water pump, you will need a gasket for between it and the water pump plate. I personally like to use a small bead of black silicone on both sides of all the gaskets to help both with alignment, and to help make a seal should anything be slightly out of square.

To find the actual TDC of your engine, you need to install a piston stop in cylinder number one. You then install a degree wheel on the crankshaft and a marker needle on the block. Set your marker needle to right over 0 degrees, or some other convenient number that you can use as a reference mark. Rotate your engine clockwise until your piston hits the stop and record the reading, then rotate the engine counter clockwise until it once again hits the stop. Record the second reading. Find the degrees difference between the two recorded values and divide that in half to get true TDC. Remove the piston stop and rotate the engine until your needle is sitting right on top of the value you calculated to be TDC.

You can then establish if your harmonic balancer's mark is indeed still accurate (if it ever was in the first place, some can be 5 degrees out from the factory). If it isn't, you can then adjust your timing tab so 0 degrees is directly above the line on the balancer.

To check your timing, you need to purchase a diesel timing meter, I personally use an old analog Snap-On MT480. Most of these meters have a magnetic probe that you insert into the hole on your timing tab so it sits a paper's distance away from the balancer and a dummy glow plug with a quartz window in it that allows a photosensitive detector on the meter to see the combustion occurring in the engine. The dummy glow plug is installed on cylinder number 3 in a 6.2L / 6.5L diesel engine. It then uses the two values to determine what the timing is at and what RPM the engine is at.

Where you set your timing depends on if you are turbocharged, your injection pump, EGR / non EGR etc. I set my turbocharged 6.2L diesel with 82 heads / coarse injectors, C code injection pump (turned up a bit), and non-EGR 6.5L turbo intake + GM-3 turbocharger at about 3 degrees BTDC at 1300 rpm and found that my engine was happiest there.

One thing I found very interesting. When I originally set the timing on my engine, I simply set the timing a line width to the advanced side of things from the marks on the IP and the timing cover. When I checked my timing, I was majorly advanced (like 6 degrees ATDC). I had always had issues with incomplete combustion at idle / part throttle, and the engine always clattered very loud compared to most other diesel engines. When I set the timing with the meter, I was unable to visually tell that I had rotated the injection pump at all based on where the lines were... After setting the timing properly, my engine clatters normally and all the blue smoke is gone. Not only that, but the turbo spools faster and my boost increased by almost 1 PSI. I did notice a slight (75F) increase in EGTs however.
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Old 05-14-2009, 08:34 AM   #6 (permalink)
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i thought i could just take off my timing cover turn the engine till the marks are lined up and call that TDC make a mark on my damper and make the timing cover marker line up with my damper mark then ill change my chain and throw it all backtogether and work from there i dont really want to change my water pump yet if i dont have to im still debating on the timing chain but its probably not helping my power having the cam off a few derease either
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1985 GMC (The Brown Streak) Sierra Classic 1500 4WD With 6.2L V8 Diesel and 4speed NP833 trans with hurst shifter! , 4911 6.5 ip with 6.5 shortie injectors GM-3 turbo. Single plane J code intake from Turbonator (thanks guys!). 3" exhaust and 3" BBQ black stacks! Isspro Pyrometer, Trisco Boost and Engine Oil Temp Gauges.
1995 Dodge 2500 Cummins 12 valve NV4500 4x4 LB club cab autometer boost and pyro BrentBilt fuel plate full forward silencer ring MIA straight pipe AFC totally maxed out
1977 GMC high sierra 6500 2WD with 366V8 and 5+2 speed trans
1968 Mercury (The Tank) M-100 2WD with 300 I-6 and 3 on the tree trans
1971 John Deere 4320 with a 404CID With A Factory Shwitzer 3LD turbocharger Crankin 116 horsepower with over 9700 origininal hours on the engine never rebuilt!
1978 John Deere 8630 with a reman 619 CID Diesel out of a 8650 With A Factory Aireasearch TV-6102 turbocharger Crankin 320 Horsepower and 1700 torque
Quote:
Originally Posted by diaric View Post
your wrong brent, i'll think of a reason later

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Originally Posted by diaric View Post
brent can't do that, it would look factory, lol

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Originally Posted by Trios View Post
Brent is right.
Was there any ever doubt?
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Old 05-14-2009, 02:08 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Every 6.2L I've pulled apart had timing chains with slop many times beyond spec. The engines still ran fine, but had far more power once I replaced the chain. Well worth the $200 for gaskets and the chain itself as far as I am concerned!

You don't really have to set TDC using a degree wheel, but it is by far the most accurate way of going about it. You can also remove an injector and use a screwdriver to feel when the piston stops moving up in it's bore to check the relative accuracy of the balancer's mark.
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Old 05-14-2009, 06:11 PM   #8 (permalink)
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i think ill do that im kinda all for eisier stuff
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1985 GMC (The Brown Streak) Sierra Classic 1500 4WD With 6.2L V8 Diesel and 4speed NP833 trans with hurst shifter! , 4911 6.5 ip with 6.5 shortie injectors GM-3 turbo. Single plane J code intake from Turbonator (thanks guys!). 3" exhaust and 3" BBQ black stacks! Isspro Pyrometer, Trisco Boost and Engine Oil Temp Gauges.
1995 Dodge 2500 Cummins 12 valve NV4500 4x4 LB club cab autometer boost and pyro BrentBilt fuel plate full forward silencer ring MIA straight pipe AFC totally maxed out
1977 GMC high sierra 6500 2WD with 366V8 and 5+2 speed trans
1968 Mercury (The Tank) M-100 2WD with 300 I-6 and 3 on the tree trans
1971 John Deere 4320 with a 404CID With A Factory Shwitzer 3LD turbocharger Crankin 116 horsepower with over 9700 origininal hours on the engine never rebuilt!
1978 John Deere 8630 with a reman 619 CID Diesel out of a 8650 With A Factory Aireasearch TV-6102 turbocharger Crankin 320 Horsepower and 1700 torque
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Originally Posted by diaric View Post
your wrong brent, i'll think of a reason later

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Originally Posted by diaric View Post
brent can't do that, it would look factory, lol

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Originally Posted by Trios View Post
Brent is right.
Was there any ever doubt?
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Old 05-18-2009, 12:11 PM   #9 (permalink)
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for now im going to ajust the timing so what mark do i line up on the damper? i know the one in the ip but not the one on the damper cause my book says jsut to line up the ip mark with the mark on the timing cover but since my timing chain might be stretched thats not an option
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1985 GMC (The Brown Streak) Sierra Classic 1500 4WD With 6.2L V8 Diesel and 4speed NP833 trans with hurst shifter! , 4911 6.5 ip with 6.5 shortie injectors GM-3 turbo. Single plane J code intake from Turbonator (thanks guys!). 3" exhaust and 3" BBQ black stacks! Isspro Pyrometer, Trisco Boost and Engine Oil Temp Gauges.
1995 Dodge 2500 Cummins 12 valve NV4500 4x4 LB club cab autometer boost and pyro BrentBilt fuel plate full forward silencer ring MIA straight pipe AFC totally maxed out
1977 GMC high sierra 6500 2WD with 366V8 and 5+2 speed trans
1968 Mercury (The Tank) M-100 2WD with 300 I-6 and 3 on the tree trans
1971 John Deere 4320 with a 404CID With A Factory Shwitzer 3LD turbocharger Crankin 116 horsepower with over 9700 origininal hours on the engine never rebuilt!
1978 John Deere 8630 with a reman 619 CID Diesel out of a 8650 With A Factory Aireasearch TV-6102 turbocharger Crankin 320 Horsepower and 1700 torque
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Originally Posted by diaric View Post
your wrong brent, i'll think of a reason later

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brent can't do that, it would look factory, lol

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Originally Posted by Trios View Post
Brent is right.
Was there any ever doubt?
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Old 05-18-2009, 01:10 PM   #10 (permalink)
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My 6.2 has been going down hill, getting harder to start, and belches black smoke every time I step on it. Fuel milage terrible.

I changed the fuel filter, added an electric fuel pump, replaced all 8 glow plugs, yes I have checked to be sure they were working, did fuel pressure test 8-10psi at idle. Did a compression test, 450 on the best one 360 the worst, 380 on the other 6. test was done with the engine cold.

I turned the IP up 1/8 turn, got more black smoke, but no extra power or easier starts. Engine has required ether to start on several occations...

Then a friend at work told me that the timing chain stretches on high mile engines and that can cause the IP timing to retard signifgantly.

Mine has 250,000 on the origanal parts, so I advanced the IP timing about 1mm toward the drivers side, ( mine showed that by the timing marks that it was a little retarded to start with.) WOW, what a difference!

It now starts easier on the 4 glow plugs that are working than when all 8 were new! Power has jumped up and I am smoking a whole lot less!

Has any one else had similar results?
this is from hard starting, black smoke,no power, fixed
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